Day Game Tip: Avoid Instadates; Meet in the Evening
September 6, 2009
A month ago, I had the pleasure of hanging out with Jeremy Soul, the Love Systems Day Game Specialist, for several days. Considering Love System’s reputation for relying on canned routines and overly complicated theories, I was glad to find that we agreed on a lot of points, especially in regard to direct, natural game. It was also refreshing to see this in what Mr. M of Love Systems was teaching. I believe that some of this commonality can be traced back to the inter-continental influence of Sebastian Drake 
One important point that Jeremy and I both advocated in daytime interactions is efficiency and not wasting time with insta-dates. He’s finally gotten around to writing this article elucidating why the common community advice of going on insta-dates can actually be counterproductive. My experience has also been the same. It’s encouraging and validating to see that another Day Game specialist agrees. The community owes him a big “thanks” for getting this out there. Jeremy does a great job explaining this:
Don’t Waste Your Time With Instant Dates
I am going to disagree with conventional wisdom on Day Game here and say that I am against instant dates. An instant date is where you go for a coffee or some kind of mini-date with a woman immediately after having met her in the daytime.
Traditionally, a lot of guys that practice Day Game advocate going on instant dates with women. It’s said that they progress the interaction, build comfort and reduce flakiness.
Indeed, I used to be one of the guys that advocated insta-dating girls. But everything evolves and over time I’ve discovered instant dates to be less efficient than setting up dates for later on, preferably in the evening that night or if not, an evening within the next few days.
When you meet a woman during the daytime, chances are you won’t be able to get physically intimate with her until nightfall. Part of this is down to simple logistics: she is most likely in the middle of errands, on her break from work, or in between meetings. You may well be busy too. For most people, the evening is when they have the majority of their downtime, when it’s likely they’d be able to spend a couple of hours getting intimate with you.
Part of this is down to the psychology of sex. People associate nightfall with intimacy. Therefore if you are going to spend time with a woman with the possibility of sleeping with her, you should arrange for that time to be in the evening.
The final reason is that women like the element of mystery, the feeling of not knowing exactly what is going to happen. If you spend a couple of hours with a woman in the afternoon, taking a long walk though the park or chatting over coffee for a couple of hours, a lot of that mystery is gone. Suddenly, she knows a lot about you and you’ve become that “really interesting guy she spent an afternoon chatting with” instead of the guy she met up with in the evening and went home with.
Of course there are always going to be exceptions to this. It certainly is possible to meet a woman in the middle of the afternoon and get her home before it’s nightfall. It’s also possible to go on instant dates that last until nightfall and then take the woman home. But these are exceptions rather than the rule.
In most cases, your best bet for securing a solid date and for not wasting your time is to build a connection based on Attraction and Qualification (see the Love Systems Triad if you don’t know what these are) for about 5 minutes and then set up a date for an evening sometime soon (ideally that night).
I don’t think instant dates should never be tried. They’re certainly good for showing you what’s possible: that you can go on a random date with a woman you’ve just met in the middle of the day. But instant dates should be a feather in your cap rather than the arrows in your quiver.
This is probably going to be a controversial post and I’m sure there will be those that disagree with me. I think continual experimentation is important to develop any skill, so I invite you to experiment: if you have never tried instant dates, try going on a few, and if you usually do a lot of them, try avoiding them completely. See what happens.
Credit to the Asian Rake for encouraging me to write this article. I recently met him in Singapore and after talking about day game, it became clear that we shared some similar views. David – I hope to see you next time I am in Singapore.
Jeremy Soul
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10 Responses to “Day Game Tip: Avoid Instadates; Meet in the Evening”
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David, love you bro, but you couldn’t be more wrong here. I get what Soul is saying, and if you’re just trying to instadate in order to solidify a number it’s a waste of time, but instadates are all about the same day lay. If you listen to Sinn or El Topo talk about day game (or see them do it), you realize that all of the traditional rules about what you can and cannot do with a girl in the day are totally wrong. You can still touch during the day, sexually frame, escalate, etc. Obviously a lot of that involves screening for logistics early on in the interaction, but if the logistics are good, instadate away and treat it like any other first date. Take her on an adventure a-la every typical romantic comedy and go from there.
Hey Hammer,
I understand what you’re saying. I used to think the same thing.
It’s not that instadates don’t or can’t work. Of course, they can. But I just don’t think they are the most efficient use of the time. Often, you can get generate even more intrigue and deeper attraction off a 3-minute contact close than from a 2-hour instadate. When you meet up later after a short contact close, it’s much easier to control the logistics.
In any case, if it’s working for you, keep at it. No need to fix what ain’t broke. But you should give the “short initial close and then follow up later” strategy a good try. You’ll probably find what Jeremy and I both have–that’s it much more efficient.
Like Jeremy says above, Instadates are more like the feather in your cap than the bow in your quiver. Nice simile.
hey david.
really appreciate all the advice and stuff you write. definitely a lot of good stuff here… apart from the advice some of the weirdos that are on your blogroll..
Hey asian rake
Have you noticed that as community guys grow and evolve they have started moving towards more efficient methods? It seems to be a big trend. Even when stuff works really well, if it takes a bunch of time, eventually people will drop that from their arsenal in favor of stuff that is quick and efficient.
For example, in the beginning, with say mystery method, a community guy would stay in a set for a long time trying to build enough attraction to take a girl home, even if it wasn’t happening no matter what he did. however, a few years later that same community guy might give a girl 5 minutes of his time to impress him before moving on.
Now I’m not saying that it’s always bad to be inefficient, sometimes the way that takes more time is more enjoyable. I just notice that as people progress they tend to become much more efficient, cutting out the unnecessary crap.
have you noticed the same thing?
Also, do you think it is necessary for a guy to go through all that inefficiency if he’s new? why couldn’t people just learn the short and sweet way first, instead of going through the years of pain and wasted time?
thanks for your opinion and keep up the good work on the blog
-Patrick
Great post.
Funnily enough I remember you commenting around 2006 that my penchant to instant date might have been hurting me. Jeez 2006!!!! Ahead of the curve there D-man.
Looking back on my experiences now, I don’t think it made a difference either way. Instant date didn’t hurt or hinder my chances. I have noticed for night game though that short but good interactions are often actually more solid , than longer sets. Not sure if that is just down to my style or if other people have experienced it to.
Hi Doctor,
I am a female, new to your site. The articles are insightful and interesting. Good to know that dating can be quite fruitful business.
You coach girls?
Hey J,
Thanks
Patrick,
I’m a big fan of efficiency. 80/20 and all that, as you know.
Szechy,
You have a good memory. 2006? Haha. Time flies.
Debra and G,
An honest and informed female perspective is always welcome
G, if you’re looking for advice, feel free to email me.
Play on!
Jeremy brings up some good points on the impact of instilling mystery within the woman’s mind. It’s a powerful tool that I personally use on a regular basis.
Both males and females, when left wondering, let their imaginations run wild. Fantasies of the other person they met flood their thoughts. Excitement grows.
In day game, I almost ALWAYS go direct, hold firm eye contact throughout the entire interaction, converse for 5-10 min, get the number, and meet up either that night or the next night.
It works great for me.
Never underestimate the power of mystery!
Take care guys!
Tyler H
Search And Seduce
Great point.
Instadates and dates ASAP is a challenge most guys have and I like the emphasize here on it.